Austin-worthy fork for hardtail

[mack_turtle]

My 2013 Reba RL is creakin and poppin like crazy. I don't think it's going to fold under me, but I've put that fork through hell. I've ridden it on several steel hardtails in 100 and 120mm configurations and serviced it religiously over the years. I am going to try to squeeze some more life out of it by drizzling some wicking sleeve compound into the CSU joints, but it's probably on borrowed time. I am back to the rigid steel fork for now and not really enjoying that.

If there is significant improvement to be to found in a better platform that fits within the cheap-but-not-garbage budget, what's worked for you? I don't feel the need for anything over 120mm of travel. My front wheel is 15x100, not boost, but I can always put some of those adapters on it. So a non-boost fork will work for me, if those still exist 

Edited August 1, 2019 by mack_turtle

[4fun]

3 minutes ago, mack_turtle said:

My 2013 Reba RL is creakin and poppin like crazy. I don't think it's going to fold under me, but I've put that fork through hell. I've ridden it on several steel hardtails in 100 and 120mm configurations and serviced it religiously over the years. I am going to try to squeeze some more life out of it by drizzling some wicking sleeve compound into the CSU joints, but it's probably on borrowed time. I am back to the rigid steel fork for now and not really enjoying that.

I can probably replace the CSU with a new one for about $200, but I don't know if I am doing myself a favor with that. I've always felt like the Reba was quite noodily, is that a fair assessment of that model?

If there is significant improvement to be to found in a better platform that fits within the cheap-but-not-garbage budget, what's worked for you? I don't feel the need for anything over 120mm of travel. My front wheel is 15x100, not boost, but I can always put some of those adapters on it. So a non-boost fork will work for me, if those still exist 

I run a Fox 36 on my steel hardtail, just the performance series. Bought as a brand new take off from the pros closet for ~$400 and the larger stanchions seem to give me tons of control. It’s 150mm and I doubt they make an air shaft to get you down to 120mm.

[mack_turtle]

I am under the impression that longer forks and fatter stanchions go well together. 36mm stanchions on a fork shorter than 120mm would be overkill, at least for me.

I've been burned by purchasing a used (abused) fork before so I am a bit weary of that option.

Good to know there are options out there that won't set me back a grand. Lots of "take off" forks. Not sure if those.have any sort of warranty though.

Edited July 22, 2019 by mack_turtle

[AustinBike]

My two hardtails have 130mm forks. The pike on my geared bike is a 35mm, the Fox factory on my singlespeed is a 34. Personally the 34 is fine for the hardtail, and would also be fine on my full suspension based on the way I ride.

Considering your size, I'd say a 34 is more than enough. Take a look at some of the take off options. If you get a new enough model the probability of abuse is greatly diminished. I bought a used fork from Seth, so you'd expect a high abuse factor but it was fine 😉

[Teamsloan]

Fox 34 stepcast would be a great fork if you can find a deal on a new take off. Or maybe look for a Lauf that someone got tired of after being an early adopter? It would be more comfortable than a steel rigid fork!


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[4fun]

12 hours ago, mack_turtle said:

My 2013 Reba RL is creakin and poppin like crazy. I don't think it's going to fold under me, but I've put that fork through hell. I've ridden it on several steel hardtails in 100 and 120mm configurations and serviced it religiously over the years. I am going to try to squeeze some more life out of it by drizzling some wicking sleeve compound into the CSU joints, but it's probably on borrowed time. I am back to the rigid steel fork for now and not really enjoying that.

I can probably replace the CSU with a new one for about $200, but I don't know if I am doing myself a favor with that. I've always felt like the Reba was quite noodily, is that a fair assessment of that model?

If there is significant improvement to be to found in a better platform that fits within the cheap-but-not-garbage budget, what's worked for you? I don't feel the need for anything over 120mm of travel. My front wheel is 15x100, not boost, but I can always put some of those adapters on it. So a non-boost fork will work for me, if those still exist 

I have a Fox 34 140mm 2016 performance elite and a 130mm  air shaft to go with it! It would be on my hard tail now if the orange i bought didn’t have such a long head tube that i had to slam my stem with no spacers. If you were interested and wanted to make sure you didn’t get burned on a used fork you could use it for a month and pay me later if you wanted to keep it! It’s just collecting dust and would be willing to part with it for $250. It was fully serviced about a year ago at bss.

Edited July 22, 2019 by 4fun

[Kyle]

On 7/22/2019 at 6:33 AM, AustinBike said:

My two hardtails have 130mm forks. The pike on my geared bike is a 35mm, the Fox factory on my singlespeed is a 34. Personally the 34 is fine for the hardtail, and would also be fine on my full suspension based on the way I ride.

Considering your size, I'd say a 34 is more than enough. Take a look at some of the take off options. If you get a new enough model the probability of abuse is greatly diminished. I bought a used fork from Seth, so you'd expect a high abuse factor but it was fine 😉

You ride a VerHauen, right?  How did you settle on 130mm?  I have a 120 on mine but have been toying with the idea of going to 130 or 140.  

[AustinBike]

I didn't. I bought the bike from Cycle Progression and had them build it up. I specified a Fox Factory 34 as the fork and they put everything together. Never specified the travel. I have a Pike 130 on my Verhauen geared hardtail if you ever want to borrow it to see how an extra 10mm performs.

[cody]

The Fox 34 at 120mm is a fantastic fork in Austin terrain and perfect for a light hardtail. Much better than my previous Pike. The StepCast version is one of the lightest 120mm forks that exist.

[Debo]

I just put a Manitou Mattoc Pro 120mm on my new Banshee Phantom and i'm pretty pleased with it so far, especially for the price.  I got it for $525 new from Chain Reaction.  I was also slightly more limited on choices as I went 29+ on my build and Manitou seems to have embraced the 29+ market more than the other manufacturers.

Edited July 31, 2019 by Debo

[Anita Handle]

@mack_turtle, do you have a tapered head tube or straight, narrower (1-1/8?) one? Fewer options if you don’t have tapered.


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[mack_turtle]

44mm straight, so a tapered fork fits not problem. That's what I have now. Two forks like that, actually.

[ATXZJ]

What fork did you end up getting?

[mack_turtle]

Gonna buy a used Fox 34 from @4fun. I think it's 130mm. I want to reduce the travel but I'll probably learn to love the extra squish and leave it.

[ATXZJ]

Surprised to see you were buying used.

You can't go wrong with a stiffer fork. Just reducing chassis flex and bushing striction from deflection will improve ride quality. 

My wife is 115# and I'm still going to swap the SID for a pike.

[mack_turtle]

Local used from someone trustworthy seemed fine this time. My previous experience was with an older fork from an unknown seller. The inside of the air spring had a big scratch in it that took a long time to diagnose because I was a suspension noob. (Still am.) I resolved it by switching the air spring and damper on the csu.

[AustinBike]

You'll lover the Fox 34 @130, one of my favorites.

[mack_turtle]

I bought that 140mm Fox from @4fun and it's fantastic! Or at least it will be once I've dialed it in.

Rode CnD the other night with it. 160 pound rider w/ 5+ pounds of gear. 4 volume spacers in the fork and ~75 psi in the air spring. At the end of the ride, I have only used 2/3 of the travel.

Also, the bike felt high up and sketchy in turns. The BB is very high, the front wheel much further in front of me, and I can't do much to get the handlebar lower, although I like my grips to be low. I felt very comfortable zipping around SATN tight, twisty trails (much to the horror of @ATXZJ) with a smaller fork, so this will require some tuning and adjustment as the front wheel would not stay planted enough to give me confidence. Need suggestions:

1. I need to dial in the fork settings. Most likely, I need to lose some volume spacers so I can get all the travel and/or reduce air pressure. It would be nice to allow the fork to ride a little lower. Anyone have experience with that level of fiddling?

2. I have the handlebar about as low as I can get it before the brake levers hit the top tube. If that's what it takes, I'll do it, but I don't know if it's the handlebar position or the fork action that's bugging me.

3. If those two don't do it for me, I can drop the fork to 130mm with the existing air spring parts I have, or replace some parts from Fox and drop it to 120. I bought this work because I wanted a stiffer, smoother platform and it's delivered that, but the extra travel might not be for me.

Edited August 22, 2019 by mack_turtle

[Kyle]

You should probably drop it to 130 immediately to see what that feels like.

Every time I've ridden a fox 34 I've ended up with the rebound cranked all the way slow or nearly.

My fork setup revelation was that extremely progressive with low pressure is great for our slow chunky trails.  The low pressure sacrifices some efficiency, but the beginning of the travel is extra soft to help get over rocks.  The spacers give you OTB protection when you roll something you probably should've dropped.

So if I were you I would lower the travel, check rebound, lower the pressure to use more travel, and experiment with keeping the spacers.

[mack_turtle]

I am avoiding lowering it 10mm for now as tearing the fork apart sounds like a PITA for such a small change, but it's on the agenda eventually. Is 10mm really that big a difference?

It sounds like a need to change the damper if I want to go lower than 130.

Edited August 22, 2019 by mack_turtle

[CBaron]

27 minutes ago, mack_turtle said:

I am avoiding lowering it 10mm for now as tearing the fork apart sounds like a PITA for such a small change, but it's on the agenda eventually. Is 10mm really that big a difference?

 

 

With someone has specific as you in regards to bike fit and bar height, then I'd say yes.  Its not necessarily just this 10mm, but once you get to the edges of adjustments, then every 10 mm counts.  I too like my bars low and pull every trick I can to get them to *that* spot....lever-TT contact be damned!  I think I'm at a very workable position for me, but I've contemplated going to that FSA (or Syntace) super drop stem. 

What length of travel fork did you have prior?  (whats the difference in axle to crown?)

Later, -CJB

[rockshins]

1 hour ago, mack_turtle said:

I bought that 140mm Fox from @4fun and it's fantastic! Or at least it will be once I've dialed it in.

Rode CnD the other night with it. 160 pound rider w/ 5+ pounds of gear. 4 volume spacers in the fork and ~75 psi in the air spring. At the end of the ride, I have only used 2/3 of the travel.

Also, the bike felt high up and sketchy in turns. The BB is very high, the front wheel much further in front of me, and I can't do much to get the handlebar lower, although I like my grips to be low. I felt very comfortable zipping around SATN tight, twisty trails (much to the horror of @ATXZJ) with a smaller fork, so this will require some tuning and adjustment as the front wheel would not stay planted enough to give me confidence. Need suggestions:

1. I need to dial in the fork settings. Most likely, I need to lose some volume spacers so I can get all the travel and/or reduce air pressure. It would be nice to allow the fork to ride a little lower. Anyone have experience with that level of fiddling?

2. I have the handlebar about as low as I can get it before the brake levers hit the top tube. If that's what it takes, I'll do it, but I don't know if it's the handlebar position or the fork action that's bugging me.

3. If those two don't do it for me, I can drop the fork to 130mm with the existing air spring parts I have, or replace some parts from Fox and drop it to 120. I bought this work because I wanted a stiffer, smoother platform and it's delivered that, but the extra travel might not be for me.

What's your sag at? How much compression damping are you running (Fit4)? How much rebound damping are you running? Do you like a super progressive fork (4 volume spacers is pretty progressive)? 

Edited August 22, 2019 by rockshins

[mack_turtle]

1 minute ago, rockshins said:

What's your sag at? How much compression damping are you running (Fit4)? How much rebound damping are you running? Do you like a super progressive fork (4 volume spacers is pretty progressive)? 

Do I like a progressive fork? Not sure yet. Maybe someone can tell me what I am shooting for based on the following:

I set it up with at least 25% sag at the beginning but didn't use all my travel ever.

I set the three-position dial in the middle and ended up riding with it full open by the end of my ride. Compression damping was intensionally set right in the middle and I ended the ride with it fully open.

Started the Fit4 rebound in the middle and knocked it up two clicks mid-ride for more damping, if that makes sense.

[mack_turtle]

23 minutes ago, CBaron said:

What length of travel fork did you have prior?  (whats the difference in axle to crown?)

Later, -CJB

Current Fox has an a-c of about 545mm and a 51mm offset. That should be about 510 sagged. I believe this is the 27.5+ version, not the 29er, although I have a 29x2.4 tire in it with plenty of room.

That's 20mm taller than my 120 Reba and with more offset, and 30mm+ taller (sagged) than my rigid fork! (Comparing a rigid fork to a squish is hard because you have to pick sag or no sag.)

Consider that my BB goes up with the fork, so the handlebar should be in the same position relative to my feet because I set up my cockpit the same way. I think this created a considerable rearward bias though, partially because it also pushed my seat angle back for seated pedaling. All the more reason to drop the front end by softening the suspension, dropping the bar, and maybe dropping the travel.

I'll look into the air spring. I've dissected several Fox products with Nick @ Fox, but I've had no subsequent practice. Probably just need some Fox bath oil.

I have a Syntace 44mm/ -30° stem in my parts bin. It's LOW. Might have to try that.

Edited August 22, 2019 by mack_turtle

[CBaron]

17 minutes ago, mack_turtle said:

Current Fox has an a-c of about 545mm and a 51mm offset. That should be about 510 sagged. I believe this is the 27.5+ version, not the 29er, although I have a 29x2.4 tire in it with plenty of room.

That's 20mm taller than my 120 Reba and with more offset, and 30mm+ taller (sagged) than my rigid fork! (Comparing a rigid fork to a squish is hard because you have to pick sag or no sag.)

Consider that my BB goes up with the fork, so the handlebar should be in the same position relative to my feet because I set up my cockpit the same way. I think this created a considerable rearward bias though, partially because it also pushed my seat angle back for seated pedaling. All the more reason to drop the front end by softening the suspension, dropping the bar, and maybe dropping the travel.

I'll look into the air spring. I've dissected several Fox products with Nick @ Fox, but I've had no subsequent practice. Probably just need some Fox bath oil.

I have a Syntace 44mm/ -30° stem in my parts bin. It's LOW. Might have to try that.

I'd bite the bullet and drop that Fox to 120 and be done with it.  Then you've achieved exactly what you wanted...a better stiffer fork with very little change to your setup.

-CJB