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The first sign of the apocalypse


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Took my ebike to my Dr Appt today and when I came back to the house in my Cul de Sac was an ebike, an eScooter and around me were 2 other scooters.

These people were door knocking selling windows or some such but what an easier way to cover more of the neighboorhood.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Tensions rise as as Coloradans debate how much trail access to give e-bikes Some say they’re a great tool for accessibility. Others argue they’re bringing chaos to the backcountry

Good summary of the issues around eBikes on public lands in the West.

We were in the Mountain Bike Specialists  store in Durango last week. A 60+ guy was buying an eBike to ride the Aquarius Trail Hut System in Utah, which has a LOT of climbing at high elevations.   I think the recharge is provided via generator at each hut location. 

We did a trip in south central Utah with Western Spirit a few years ago. They carried a generator for anyone wanting to do the trip on an eBike. 

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Best way to enjoy nature:  with the droning sound of a generac /s

 

So at what rate do ebikes charge?  It seems to me that a solar generator would be optimal and with single PV panels hitting 400+ Watts, that means you'd charge from zero to full at 1C in about 1-2 hours with a single panel (depending on the battery size.)

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2 hours ago, AustinBike said:

Saw this on a trial this morning.

image.thumb.jpeg.72928d38d83e4f8aa6b25f933312c5a5.jpeg

Yeah that is all over the place in North Carolina. 

That article is really good @June Bug thanks!

It covers a lot of the sticky issues, but it makes me wonder about what is the essence of the resistance to e-bikes.  Based on class 1 and class 2 (essentially an electric motorcycle limited to 20mph, and a bike above 20mph) being accepted but not class 3 (an e-bike all the way to 28mph and a bike above 28mph) it seems to me that most of the issues people have are with speed.   And they must have a misunderstanding on how these bikes work.  They did mention downhill riders being an annoyance to hikers because of the speed.  So it seems it's nothing to do with cheating or not but all to do with speed.   I do also think there's a sense of wanting to limit trail access.  Nobody says it, but it does seem like there is an undercurrent of that.

 

Finally, nowhere do they mention cheap Amazon/Alibaba e-bikes that catch fire and could cause a forest to go up in flames.  I believe gasoline engine off-road cars and things like chainsaws must have spark arresting mufflers/exhausts.  It seems to me that they should require only UL-listed (or similar testing agency) e-bikes only.

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The short answer is that if you cannot manage the subtleties than you kill the category. This is an issue for the industry. They could have worked out the details amongst themselves, come up with some good marketing and marking for the bikes, and come out on top. Instead they chose hands off and let someone else decide.

It is like crypto currency- the “true believers” didn’t want anyone telling them what to do. Now they are facing regulation. Either accept that your product is part of an ecosystem and try to work with people or just ramrod it through. It’s your call.  Too many people took the latter.

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1 hour ago, AntonioGG said:

Finally, nowhere do they mention cheap Amazon/Alibaba e-bikes that catch fire and could cause a forest to go up in flames.  I believe gasoline engine off-road cars and things like chainsaws must have spark arresting mufflers/exhausts.  It seems to me that they should require only UL-listed (or similar testing agency) e-bikes only

Wait until a few forest fires happen and a low quality eBike is found to be at fault. 

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On 8/12/2022 at 10:47 AM, Taco Man said:

Took my ebike to my Dr Appt today and when I came back to the house in my Cul de Sac was an ebike, an eScooter and around me were 2 other scooters.

A year or two ago cruising down the bike lane on north Guadalupe I was passed by a guy on an electric skate board.  He held the controller in his hand, about the size of a small TV remote. 

 

 

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Got to ride a levoSL at elevation in Telluride and walked away with a completely different attitude about e-bikes. The 240w motor was perfect amount of assist, even on the low assist setting. The bike totally helped me get up some steep trails that i would have given up on miles earlier. Maybe there's a happy medium to land access where regulatory bodies could limit the motor/wattage by creating another class(?) Make the nomenclature obvious for rangers etc.  Nobody is hauling ass up hills with a 240w bike, at least not for long. Once at the top, I can go just as fast down the hill, if not faster on a traditional bike. To me, downhill doesn't seem to be the issue.

Lets be honest, most mountain bikers with the coin to drop, are in their 40-50s+. Myself included. We're going to age out of the sport whether by choice, or natural circumstances at some point. If an e-bike will keep me riding challenging trails with the younger groups when I'm in my 60s, so be it. 

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/turbo-levo-sl

https://formative.jmir.org/2019/3/e13643

 

 

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1 hour ago, ATXZJ said:

Nobody is hauling ass up hills with a 240w bike, at least not for long. Once at the top, I can go just as fast down the hill, if not faster on a traditional bike.

100% this.  My brother and I were on road bikes going up mount hood and two young guys on emtb passed us at a leisurely pace.  They were doing the no lift option.  I think it’s cool.

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4 hours ago, mack_turtle said:

I really enjoy Mike Ferrentino's writing in general, but this is pretty spot-on.

https://nsmb.com/articles/the-luxury-of-hypocrisy/

Great article.

And after the Liverpool match is over this afternoon I'm going to be calling shops here about renting an e-bike. For my wife. So that we can ride at the same speed for the same distance. Not on trails. I'm all in favor of that, it's a valid use case. But even though I know I could rent an Orbea ebike and hit the trails, that holds no interest for me.

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21 hours ago, mack_turtle said:

I really enjoy Mike Ferrentino's writing in general, but this is pretty spot-on.

https://nsmb.com/articles/the-luxury-of-hypocrisy/

Awesome article and illustrates a nuanced perspective in which he doesn't throw up his arms if he can't do all the things that are good for the environment.  You see similar things when it comes to a lot of things (like diet, or spending, or...).  It also touches on something I've thought about a lot.  The attraction toward lift parks or eMTB to ride up and enjoy the ride down with the assist of gravity. What if you ride an e-dirt bike on a non-mountain course instead?  I started thinking about this as I read about some gigantic platform being built somewhere extremely flat so that they can enjoy gravity assist riding. I like the thought of e-dirt bikes some times, and analog MTB others.

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56 minutes ago, AntonioGG said:

 The attraction toward lift parks or eMTB to ride up and enjoy the ride down with the assist of gravity. 

The attraction towards lift parks is pretty strong for me. At this point, climbing is at best a necessary evil so we can bomb down the hill. 

After returning to the mountains, fire roads are my preferred climbing method🤣

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2 hours ago, Barry said:

Maybe you ought to move to North Cali, Washington state, or PNW then? Sounds absolutely like your preference. Nothing but gravel roads up, and singletrack down. 

For sure! Looked closely in those areas but they each have their drawbacks that we'd prefer to avoid after our time in austin. Right now, our goal is to purchase a place here in quebec before the end of september and get out by christmas. Good thing is the area we're looking in is 20 minutes from two lift serviced bike parks. For the states, looking like western virginia with a layover in fayettevile ar might be in our future. Roanoke is 2-4hrs from multiple bike parks so we can get our fix regardless of where we are. Will probably buy a DH bike way before an e-bike.

Will also confess that riding Sentiers du Moulin bike park had me wanting an ebike so i could get more laps in. 

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3 hours ago, Barry said:

Maybe you ought to move to North Cali, Washington state, or PNW then? Sounds absolutely like your preference. Nothing but gravel roads up, and singletrack down. 

So is SoCal. The places we are looking are loaded with tons of trails and tons of gravel opportunities. The fact that it is 72F most of the year is not a bad thing either.

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16 hours ago, AustinBike said:

So is SoCal. The places we are looking are loaded with tons of trails and tons of gravel opportunities. The fact that it is 72F most of the year is not a bad thing either.

My mom lived in Newport Beach and there was some great stuff down by Laguna. Also a place where a lot of people are riding e-bikes.

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On 8/31/2022 at 10:17 AM, ATXZJ said:

>If an e-bike will keep me riding challenging trails with the younger groups when I'm in my 60s, so be it. 

Don't sell yourself short - George Dawkins keeps up with the group at age 80-something on his e-bike, and I sure I hope I'm doing the same in 30 years!

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14 hours ago, June Bug said:

I get the appeal NOW, but winter is long, dark and cold.  

Summer home only. We looked all over for states with resorts/lift bike parks and couldn't come close to price of ownership in the USA as we can here. 

 

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On 9/1/2022 at 12:26 PM, ATXZJ said:

Will also confess that riding Sentiers du Moulin bike park had me wanting an ebike so i could get more laps in. 

Skills with Phil had a video from there recently. Definitely looked like fun! Climb back up didn’t seem too horrible but I can see less effort up on an ebike means more trips down. I loved Duthie in Seattle area because the ride back to the middle was super easy!

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