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Trail Runners


B.J.

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My wife is a serious trail runner and here is her take. Trail runners are just like mountain bikers, there is a huge variety in personal preference in what they like in a trail. Some like the gnar with rocks and climbs. Others like it runnable with gentle ‘flow’. Most like variety. However, she is in deep with the trail running community and she knows of no one that would ever modify a trail. I seriously doubt that trail runners are the source of any trail sanitation issues.


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apparently some heavy trail sanitation occurred in a segment of SATN recently. most likely, it's people on bikes (not the same thing as "mountain bikers") who want everything to flow like a sidewalk. guess what, there are sidewalks and bike paths EVERYWHERE! no need to make yet another one.

I can't imagine trail runners taking the time to smash boulders to make a trail more smooth.

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19 minutes ago, mack_turtle said:

apparently some heavy trail sanitation occurred in a segment of SATN recently. most likely, it's people on bikes (not the same thing as "mountain bikers") who want everything to flow like a sidewalk. guess what, there are sidewalks and bike paths EVERYWHERE! no need to make yet another one.

I can't imagine trail runners taking the time to smash boulders to make a trail more smooth.

But I have seen hikers (not runners) removing obstacles. I would not necessarily say that it is bikers all the time. Bikers ride single file with ~2" width of trail contact. Hikers are often two abreast and have both a wider path contact and alternating steps. When you see a rock on a technical feature it is probably 90% a biker moving it, but when it is part of the main path AND there is an easy line already I'd put my money on it being hikers/walkers.

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3 hours ago, AustinBike said:

But I have seen hikers (not runners) removing obstacles. I would not necessarily say that it is bikers all the time. Bikers ride single file with ~2" width of trail contact. Hikers are often two abreast and have both a wider path contact and alternating steps. When you see a rock on a technical feature it is probably 90% a biker moving it, but when it is part of the main path AND there is an easy line already I'd put my money on it being hikers/walkers.

You've got to make the trail easy to pull your rolling beer cooler on the BCGB, come on!  /sarcasm

As far as trail running, I don't like super twisty trails that make me feel like I'm going nowhere.  I like trails that make me feel like I'm heading somewhere.  If it wasn't for the challenge of handling tight turns on the bike, I wouldn't ride them either.  Switchbacks to head up a hill are good.  Super twisty trail on flat land not as good.

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I trail run about equal time as mountain biking, especially on the same trails in the BCGB. When you're doing it right, the pace and time is similar. The ups are faster and downs are slower when running, and technical rocky trails increase the fun-factor. I probably take harder spills running than biking.

On my bike, I usually yell to trail runners, "keep running! don't stop for me. I've got plenty of room". Yes, yes and yes..on the earbuds. They are my peeve (and uncontrollable off-leash dogs).

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On 3/17/2020 at 7:53 AM, mack_turtle said:

where do you like to run? I find that running twisty, technical trails where I like to ride is not very much fun on foot.

I actually do like the twisty trails. Pretty much any trails- long flat trails can get boring but they're ok I guess. I probably run the most at Brushy Creek, Bull Creek, and Walnut Creek. And I personally don't like "disappearing" as you mentioned, so we're good there.

Edited by B.J.
clarity and spelling
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On 3/17/2020 at 7:35 AM, Trailrider said:

They seem ok to me. I do think most trail runners I pass give me too much space and interrupt their workouts too long to let me by. All you have to do is move aside at the last millisecond, like turn your shoulders to the side so my bars fit. It should be easy. You don't have to jump off the trail.

That's good to know. I usually try and get out of the way in the way you're explaining, mostly just to show "I promise I'm not being a jerk, see?" But maybe I'm worrying too much. 🙂

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On 3/17/2020 at 9:15 PM, The Tip said:

...you posting got me curious again.

I had a quick discussion with a runner the other day but didn't really get the answers I wanted. The trail sanitation discussions here that mentioned that someone thought it was trail runners doing some of it made we shake my head. I didn't understand that. I thought the idea of being a trail runner WAS  to find the uneven stuff. 

What are the motives for trail running besides communing with our wonderful nature and getting a run in? What makes a trail "good."

Are there competitive trail runs? What are those courses like? 

Several riders here mentioned they trail run too. Chime in with your opinion. I'm "professionally" curious about this wondering if there is a way to make trails "good" for both user groups.

I've not been a part of any trail running groups, except for two on FB where I sometimes post, nothing "on the ground".

-To my knowledge, most trail runners wouldn't want to take down any obstacles, we're just as aggravated seeing them being taken down or messed with.
-Most trail runners just want to run somewhere other than on the concrete with car exhaust in their faces, to be in nature and all, like a lot of mtbers. There are a good amount who enjoy exploring, wandering on trails, going adventuring. Then there are the ones like myself. I too like to explore, but it's a ton of fun running on "treacherous" trails over loose rocks, scrambling up rocks, running through water, twisty and turny, between trees with branches slapping you, through high grass, etc. Why? I guess just the thrill of it.
-A good trail is subjective. To be simplistic about it: The northwest of St Edwards is good for people who like nice, flat runs. The southeast, of course, gets into the likes of the more adventurous of us. All in all, the best trail is a "trail system", like Bull Creek or Brushy Creek, which have flat open trails and twisty technical trails.
-There are competitive trail runs, even series, and there are wilderness runs where you run for more than one day across lots of wilderness, usually on teams. And of course Ultras, like 50K-100+mile races- yikes. I've only once ever run a competitive 50 miler (almost 20 years ago) in which I gave up halfway through because I'd never run on trails before, ALL my training was on concrete, then suddenly I'm surrounded forever by trees and the dirt was totally different on the feet than concrete. It was basically just hiking trails through the woods.
-You know what, I've never really thought about this. Maybe I'll ask this on the FB groups and see what they say.

Thx for all the questions 🙂

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On 3/17/2020 at 4:12 PM, Sluggo said:

I just feel sorry for them. 

I was at Walnut Creek Metro Park the other day, getting some high-stepping hill climbing workouts (powerline hill and close by).  As I was going up on section of trail that gets fairly steep with large step-ups and lots of trees roots and rocks to navigate, I saw an mtber trying to go UP with his bike. His face was like, "This was a mistake", and when he saw me bound past him, I'm pretty sure he thought, "That guy's nuts". lol I feel sorry for those guys.

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16 hours ago, mack_turtle said:

apparently some heavy trail sanitation occurred in a segment of SATN recently.

What is SATN? Context tells me it's a trail/trail system, but I'm wracking my brain and nothing is forthcoming from those initials. Thx

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23 hours ago, mack_turtle said:

apparently some heavy trail sanitation occurred in a segment of SATN recently. most likely, it's people on bikes (not the same thing as "mountain bikers") who want everything to flow like a sidewalk. guess what, there are sidewalks and bike paths EVERYWHERE! no need to make yet another one.

I can't imagine trail runners taking the time to smash boulders to make a trail more smooth.

Very good point about casual bikers. I've seen many people on bikes that are definitely not meant to be on trails. I've seen people on road bikes attempting to ride SN and 1/4 Notch. Could possibly be these types of people modifying trails.

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4 minutes ago, B.J. said:

Who is willing to sit out there for hours in their ghillie suit?  Bring snacks and take shifts. 😆

don't put it past mountain bikers to set up a hidden game camera in a place that is not their own property to catch trail sanitizers. it's been done before.

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16 hours ago, B.J. said:

I was at Walnut Creek Metro Park the other day, getting some high-stepping hill climbing workouts (powerline hill and close by).  As I was going up on section of trail that gets fairly steep with large step-ups and lots of trees roots and rocks to navigate, I saw an mtber trying to go UP with his bike. His face was like, "This was a mistake", and when he saw me bound past him, I'm pretty sure he thought, "That guy's nuts". lol I feel sorry for those guys.

He was doing it wrong. 

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