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South Austin Trail Network, The SATN


The Tip

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3 hours ago, The Tip said:

I took pictures of both entrances, the Self Storage driveway and the brush blocked jeep track, on the 1826 side yesterday. Neither entrance is posted with a no trespassing sign. I'm pretty sure there are no postings on the Slaughter Ln. side either.

So I am going to continue to use that cut through until they do put up signs. I can't think of what other trails we would be jeopardizing by doing so. I am certain that the jeep track is on the storage companies property. The brush blocking might be done by the homeowners that butt up against the jeep track acting on their own volition. 

Not sure how accurate land boundaries are on TCAD, but if they're fairly accurate, that jeep road - at both ends - belongs to Stor Self Storage and not the homeowners.

Travis CAD Map Search.jpg

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Austin Diagnostic Clinic is in the building behind ATX Bikes. They are open 7 days a week. They are concerned that we mountain bikers are parking down close to their building during their business hours which impacts their business. They are asking us to please park further away from their building. This should not be a problem for us to do.

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2 hours ago, eporter68 said:

I'm looking for another route around the swamp west of La Crosse Avenue. Any suggestions?
 

The Hielscher Tract Greenbelt.

There are three east-west trails through there. Phoenix North, Phoenix South, and Digo's Shortcut.

Phoenix North is on the north side of the small creek and three retention ponds. It runs past Clayton Elementary School on the west end. 

Phoenix South runs along the south side of the creek. Both of these trails have a water dispersion system that dumps water on their west ends causing swamp like conditions. Long after rain events.

Digo's Shortcut is the most southern route. This is on higher ground that is right behind the houses. It will also get too wet to ride, but it is the first to dry out, but you still have to look for puddles.

Crank and Drank went through there Tuesday. We took Phoenix South. It was soft but okay. 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Did 45 miles of SATN today with maybe 2 miles of road or concrete path and the rest was sweet, sweet single track. Big thanks to Enrique for showing us around the Meridian trails.

There is just so much fun trail out there and more keeps popping up. You guys have built something special.


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What the hell? I've been out of town. The last time I rode was Tuesday. I got out yesterday and apparently a vegetation bomb has gone off since then. Greenery everywhere! Sure it's pretty and all, but all I see is trail encroachment problems. Time to start ride the sides of the trail to knock that stuff back. It was already a problem starting to happen on the Inner Canterbury Loop. It no doubt needs a weed eating now. sigh. And so it begins.

 

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I was just about to say... Inner Canterbury loop is almost completely overgrown. I'll try to get out there with a weedeater some time.

Also, the "bonus section" of Bauerle has a lot of potential, but the route is hard to follow. Lots of natural and human-made features out there but connecting it all is confusing.

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8 minutes ago, mack_turtle said:

Also, the "bonus section" of Bauerle has a lot of potential, but the route is hard to follow. Lots of natural and human-made features out there but connecting it all is confusing.

I was confused by that too until I was taught that there is not one specific way to do it. The bonus bonus section is like a clover leaf. You do one section, that comes back to a point, where you then do the next section, etc. After doing the three short loops you return back to the regular bonus section. That part has a defined way to do it. Clockwise to take advantage of the features.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 3/28/2019 at 3:46 PM, mack_turtle said:

https://patch.com/texas/downtownaustin/la-crosse-avenue-mopac-close-long-term-starting-march-29

LaCrosse @ MOPAC will be closed for a while. Good luck getting to the Veloway. It always annoys me that a public course made specifically for bicycles is nearly impossible to get to by bicycle. 

For road bikes there isn't a great way to do it without fighting traffic in a construction zone. If you are coming from north or east the violet crown trail from Walgreens might be worth trying. It'd get you pretty close to the backside of the veloway and it's probably fine unless you are on 23cm tires. Coming from CC or anywhere west ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

In for C&D tonight.

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I walked this area yesterday with a person from Violet Crown Trail, a person from the Veloway, a Circle C neighbor and me. There was a lot of discussion of where the VCT was going, how to keep trail users (us) off the Veloway and how to get road bikes to the Veloway past all the construction. Let's just say there were no easy answers and there was not a lot of compromise.

The VCT location is fixed. It cannot change by more than a few feet in any direction. Property lines, creeks, protected trees, etc. have locked it down pretty tight. And there is enough political clout that the VCT WILL happen. The Veloway and Circle C neighbors cannot stop it.

The Veloway folks do NOT want pedestrians, pets or us dirty mountain bikers on the Veloway. They would be OK with mountain bikers if we did not track mud and rocks onto the Veloway, entered ONLY at the two official entrances, and rode the Veloway in the proper direction. Since we mountain bikers cannot do even those three things - they think we mountain bikers should not be allowed on the Veloway at all. Since the four of us watched two mountain bikers ride thru the blockage across the trail onto the Veloway, I understand why they think the only solution is to fence the Veloway from the trails. 

The road construction is going at a typical road construction pace. It is predicted to last about a year. During that year, access to the Veloway for road bikers will be tough. Put your bike in your car and drive to the Veloway or ride the trails to the Veloway. Getting thru the construction detour on a road bike is more dangerous than I would attempt. I was in my truck and felt like I was about to be hit & killed.

The Circle C neighbor was upset about losing trail he didn't ride (too difficult) and about poor access to the Veloway. The best I could offer is to tell him who to complain to in the government and tell him I didn't think it would help at all. I did offer to teach him to ride the trails. I will ride my road bike to show him it can be done easily. (Yes I have ridden my road bike on those trails. It is not hard.)

Edited by cxagent
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8 minutes ago, cxagent said:

I did offer to teach him to ride the trails. I will ride my road bike to show him it can be done easily. (Yes I have ridden my road bike on those trails. It is not hard.)

Thanks for representing mountain bikers in this discussion.  I think that your idea above is great.

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31 minutes ago, cxagent said:

The road construction is going at a typical road construction pace. It is predicted to last about a year. During that year, access to the Veloway for road bikers will be tough. Put your bike in your car and drive to the Veloway or ride the trails to the Veloway. Getting thru the construction detour on a road bike is more dangerous than I would attempt. I was in my truck and felt like I was about to be hit & killed.

This pisses me off to no end. It's a park/ facility designed specifically for bicycles, yet there is only one legitimate way to get there on a bicycle, and that one is blocked with no good alternatives. I bugged TXDOT about this via Twitter and they told me to ride my road bike ON MOPAC to get there, or take the trail under the bridge. I'd like to see a rider in a skinsuit ride their TT bike under that bridge.

Someone is gonna die on MOPAC because if their short-sighted plans.

https://twitter.com/TxDOTAustin/status/1111766270054158342?s=20

Edited by mack_turtle
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SATN riders- am I correct in my recollection that none of the CC Metro trails (No Walk in the Park, Disco Go, etc) should cross paths with the disc golf course except for one point just before you cross the main CC Metro Park driveway on the north bank? Last night, a group of us were all over the disc golf course, parading right in front of a befuddled disc golfer who had to wait while 15 or so of us got out of his way. I fear that enough conflicts with disc golfers is going to get us in trouble.

Is there any reason to get on or off the Veloway during a ride? last night our course used the last leg of the Veloway to get to Terminus. As I understand it, Veloway folks hate the fact that people leave the dirt trails around the Veloway, dragging trail dirt onto the pavement and creating potential crashes. Let's keep it in the dirt. I suggest we only use Terminus if we are trying to enter or exit the trails via La Crosse. If you want to ride Veloway, get your skinny tire bike and go do laps. (if you can get there during the construction.) Bowie Stonewall is waaaay more interesting anyways, and if you take the older bypass around Bowie Stonewall, you can report back on how bad the dog shit smell coming from that manhole is that day.

 

Addendum: apparently disc golfers DGAF so we're probably safe there. The trail in question inevitably crosses the disc golf course. Good to be mindful of that though. Their facility was there first.

 

Edited by mack_turtle
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  • 2 weeks later...

A rainy day sent me to the roads and gravel paths around south Austin. To my surprise and delight, I found that the unfinished new eastbound SH45 toll road has a paved bike path that goes from Escarpment to 1626. The path appears to not be officially open yet and littered with construction debris, but it's rideable. The trailhead that connects it to the VCT is under construction.

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Commenting on mack_turtle's posts above.

Believe it or not, there are people working on addressing problems such as the disc golfer conflicts, Veloway user conflicts, Veloway access, etc. Some of these have no 'easy solution'. Some have 'tough solutions'. Some have no solution, easy or hard. Some are considered 'temporary problems' like Veloway access during road construction.

Keep in mind that no matter what is done or what is not done - people will complain. And people will think they have a "solution" but other people think that is not only not a solution but creates a new/worse problem. This is not to say that issues should not be identified or brought up. Please do bring them up. And suggest a solution if you see one. Just don't be surprised if your "solution" is not implemented.

Now for the reason I was here to post. The City Parks and Rec Department has been hearing about trails they do not recognize as legal trails. They want to know about those trails, where they are, where they go, who built them, etc. etc. etc. I suggest EVERYONE be nice to anyone and everyone they meet on the trails. The situation is coming where one or two complaints could close a lot of trails. I also STRONGLY suggest that trails that are closed to MTB NOT be ridden at all. If you don't know what trails those are - ask someone who knows. Just because a trail has been ridden before or ridden for years does not make it legal to ride now.

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I believe most of what we count as SATN is not officially sanctioned, but generously tolerated. I keep hearing "don't worry, it's fine" from the people who lead Tuesday night rides that parade directly behind residents' back porches, other park amenities, golf course property, over and around trail barriers that were clearly put up to keep people out of private property. Then we take a group of 50+ right through those areas. Mark my words: This is going to bite us in the ass. I avoid those routes that are obviously problematic, but if I chose a safer route and then 49 others charge through it anyways, what's the point?

Edited by mack_turtle
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5 hours ago, mack_turtle said:

 Mark my words: This is going to bite us in the ass.

I avoid those routes that are obviously problematic, but if I chose a safer route and then 49 others charge through it anyways, what's the point?

That is what I have been saying for a long time mack_turtle. And the longer people use those trails the more they think there is no problem with those trails. But they don't hear the things I keep hearing. It is going to bit us at some point. And I think that point is sooner than most people think. Trails will be closed and people may be prosecuted. I hope it does not happen but it seems to be more and more likely.

Just for reference - this link is to a map of what PARD recognizes as official trails. And if you look closely (click on the area to see what the pop-up says), you will see that some areas show that MTB is not recognized as allowed. https://austin.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=c069f13f4f1a4260b8694a2cb30b5880

There are trails I will not ride. Why? Other people MIGHT avoid trouble by saying they 'didn't know' MTB was not allowed. I cannot make that argument. It is up to you to decide if you want to try that or not. So that answer to mack_turtle's last question is that he might avoid trouble that others get into.

Edited by cxagent
corrected tYpo
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1 hour ago, cxagent said:

And if you look closely (click on the area to see what the pop-up says), you will see that some areas show that MTB is not recognized as allowed. https://austin.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=c069f13f4f1a4260b8694a2cb30b5880

This link isn't working for me but I'm very interested in making sure I'm not pushing the wrong buttons out on SATN. 

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8 hours ago, cxagent said:

That is what I have been saying for a long time mack_turtle. And the longer people use those trails the more they think there is no problem with those trails. But they don't hear the things I keep hearing. It is going to bit us at some point. And I think that point is sooner than most people think. Trails will be closed and people may be prosecuted. I hope it does not happen but it seems to be more and more likely.

Just for reference - this link is to a map of what PARD recognizes as official trails. And if you look closely (click on the area to see what the pop-up says), you will see that some areas show that MTB is not recognized as allowed. https://austin.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=c069f13f4f1a4260b8694a2cb30b5880

There are trails I will not ride. Why? Other people MIGHT avoid trouble by saying they 'didn't know' MTB was not allowed. I cannot make that argument. It is up to you to decide if you want to try that or not. So that answer to mack_turtle's last question is that he might avoid trouble that others get into.

 



Nothing that I saw on the map tells us what trails mountain bikes can use in SW Austin. The closest reference is "...mixed use...".

Am I missing something?

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4 hours ago, RidingAgain said:



Nothing that I saw on the map tells us what trails mountain bikes can use in SW Austin. The closest reference is "...mixed use...".

Am I missing something?

Looks like the orange lines show hiking only trails- it’s quite a long way down the legend.

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