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Bad news for town lake

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On 11/27/2018 at 11:07 AM, RidingAgain said:

The first time I went to Negril (west end of Jamaica) was in 1972. There were pretty much only small motel-like places to stay... And just a couple of them. The only foreigners you'd fine were some hardcore American hippies and a few Europeans. Oh yes... And a few people on the run from the law. Seven miles of beautiful white sand beach and the clearest light blue water found anywhere in the world, way out in the middle of nowhere.

Paradise.

But as the Eagles said... Call somewhere paradise, you can kiss it goodbye.

The last thirty years of vacation resort development in Negril has overwhelmed the infrastructure and local society.

Sure... People make money... Lots and lots of money.

Which then brings in more and more people trying to make some of that lots and lots of money.

Which then caused those who were already established in Negril to become offended by those just coming in.

And around and around it goes... Where it will end... No one really knows.
 


The old days...

jamaica-negril-beach-hippies-sundown-1972.jpg


Then came the new days...

RNEG-slider-20160829.jpg

negril.jpg

Damn those hippies messing things up for all of us. 

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YES!!! Lime is a menace to the downtown area. Scooters are strewn everywhere. Why does out city have to become polluted with their scooters just to satisfy their business model. I see the scooter companies being like Uber/Lyft - they will push things as far as they can until the city has to step in and take charge. If you've ever had an Uber stop dead in the middle of the street to let people out you know what I mean. Zero situational awareness, it is 100% all about them. They need to understand that they are part of an ecosystem and that they need to get along with everyone else. You are part of the ecosystem and can run in harmony, but when you overpower the ecosystem you become a cancer. And you need extreme measures to battle cancer in the ecosystem.

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I'm going to throw another log into the fire:

https://www.cnet.com/news/electric-scooters-by-bird-and-lime-are-causing-injuries-and-accidents/

Quote

In Austin, the rate of accidents appears to be even higher. Doctors in Dell Seton's emergency room say they're seeing about 10 injuries a day.

"The vast majority end up getting discharged with cuts and scrapes, maybe a broken bone," said Ziebell. "But some injuries are significant."

The hospital has seen 37 severe traumas since April: eight head injuries, 23 orthopedic injuries, four facial injuries and two "other" injuries. In October alone, doctors say 18 people were admitted to either the intensive care unit or surgeries with overnight hospital stays.

 

Edited by AntonioGG
pasting plain text instead of html

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We've already had at least one death and several very severe head traumas.

If an individual on a scooter hits your car, I do not believe there is clarity about who pays. Lime and Bird are definitely not liable, I've heard that your auto insurance will not cover it. I am about to shop for new insurance (house, car, umbrella, business, etc.) and this is a top question on my list.

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We need to...I mean, *someone* needs to find a way to hack all skooters or maybe an EMP that will disable all of them. They're probably all going to end up like the bikes in China.

bikes.jpg

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Desperately grasping for a silver lining - the social media 'epic fail' videos are starting to emerge ...
 

 

  • Haha 2

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Saw two guys on one scooter today.  It looked a little dicey and they were having trouble getting going. 

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6 hours ago, Bamwa said:

What about bad news for bike shops?

Nope.

Let me put on my economics hat for a second (since I use my degree about twice a year these days).

Scooters operate in a different economic sphere. The real danger to bike shops are wives and children. Scooters compete with walking, taxicabs, buses, and ride share. All of these are essentially zero investment activities on the front end with varying degrees of flexibility - mass transit is cheap, per-ride consumption, but are fixed in route/time. Scooters, taxis, and ride share are more expensive but more flexible from a timing and route perspective.

Bikes compete with cars: some investment on the front end and ownership costs. Cars have less flexibility and also incur parking costs. Bikes will compete with self-purchased scooters (not Bird or Lime but the ones you can buy, own and maintain yourself.)

The reason that bike shops are in danger of children is that people spend a lot of money on bikes when they are single. But if they marry a non-biker, that revenue stream either stops or is greatly diminished quickly. Then children come along and there is not enough time. So mid-20's through early 40's you probably see a huge drop in bike shop spending that then kicks in as the kids are self-sufficient or divorces kick in (yeah, dark thought but let's face it, economists don't care about such things, just the facts.) 

If I were a bike shop owner and I had money to throw around on lobbying and trying to juice the market, I would invest in the following:

  • Propose legislation to make Tinder, Match and the rest of the online dating sites more difficult to use
  • Invest in Trojan and other condom manufacturers
  • Lobby to make divorce easier to execute
  • Lobby to increase the cost of marriage licenses

Notice that scooters aren't on that list. Shops only compete with purchased scooters and in that domain as a shop, I'd probably start carrying a scooter line as it can be complimentary to the bikes I am already selling.

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2 hours ago, AustinBike said:

Nope.

Let me put on my economics hat for a second (since I use my degree about twice a year these days).

Scooters operate in a different economic sphere. The real danger to bike shops are wives and children. Scooters compete with walking, taxicabs, buses, and ride share. All of these are essentially zero investment activities on the front end with varying degrees of flexibility - mass transit is cheap, per-ride consumption, but are fixed in route/time. Scooters, taxis, and ride share are more expensive but more flexible from a timing and route perspective.

Bikes compete with cars: some investment on the front end and ownership costs. Cars have less flexibility and also incur parking costs. Bikes will compete with self-purchased scooters (not Bird or Lime but the ones you can buy, own and maintain yourself.)

The reason that bike shops are in danger of children is that people spend a lot of money on bikes when they are single. But if they marry a non-biker, that revenue stream either stops or is greatly diminished quickly. Then children come along and there is not enough time. So mid-20's through early 40's you probably see a huge drop in bike shop spending that then kicks in as the kids are self-sufficient or divorces kick in (yeah, dark thought but let's face it, economists don't care about such things, just the facts.) 

If I were a bike shop owner and I had money to throw around on lobbying and trying to juice the market, I would invest in the following:

  • Propose legislation to make Tinder, Match and the rest of the online dating sites more difficult to use
  • Invest in Trojan and other condom manufacturers
  • Lobby to make divorce easier to execute
  • Lobby to increase the cost of marriage licenses

Notice that scooters aren't on that list. Shops only compete with purchased scooters and in that domain as a shop, I'd probably start carrying a scooter line as it can be complimentary to the bikes I am already selling.

Truth about kids and disposable cash. They can truly be fun removal machines for 18 years. 

  • I'd also add becoming a regualr donor to the local planned parenthood. 

 

On an anecdotal aside, one of my wife's coworker's vehicle was broadsided by a person on a scooter as she pulled out of her parking garage downtown. Bodyshop estimated around $700 to repair the fender and now the insurance companies are all fighting over whos going to foot the bill. On a positive note, it will thin the herd a bit. They cant do something as simple as riding a scooter?? F@ck em.

Edited by ATXZJ

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2 hours ago, AustinBike said:

If I were a bike shop owner and I had money to throw around on lobbying and trying to juice the market, I would invest in the following:

  • Propose legislation to make Tinder, Match and the rest of the online dating sites more difficult to use
  • Invest in Trojan and other condom manufacturers
  • Lobby to make divorce easier to execute
  • Lobby to increase the cost of marriage licenses

Notice that scooters aren't on that list. 

Maybe we should think long-term and put scooters on that list. Think about it: more scooters = more stupid people injuring themselves and shortening their opportunities to reproduce. When they get out of the hospital, they realize, "that was dumb I, am going to buy a bicycle instead!"

seriously though, I think the scooter thing will blow over in a year or less. they will stick around, but the novelty will wear off and there will be fewer bozos running into stationary objects. people will start using helmets, riding conscientiously, and using them less for joy-riding and more for getting places they really need to be. In the meantime, more people will become aware of the lack non-vehicular infrastructure and demand more  bike (and scooter) lanes, accountability for inattentive drivers, etc. I have a very bleak outlook on our species and even I think that's possible.

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2 hours ago, AustinBike said:

The real danger to bike shops are wives and children.

Thank you for this.  It's one of those things you laugh at until you realize how much truth there is to the statement.  

- Scott

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14 minutes ago, mack_turtle said:

Maybe we should think long-term and put scooters on that list. Think about it: more scooters = more stupid people injuring themselves and shortening their opportunities to reproduce. When they get out of the hospital, they realize, "that was dumb I, am going to buy a bicycle instead!"

seriously though, I think the scooter thing will blow over in a year or less. they will stick around, but the novelty will wear off and there will be fewer bozos running into stationary objects. people will start using helmets, riding conscientiously, and using them less for joy-riding and more for getting places they really need to be. In the meantime, more people will become aware of the lack non-vehicular infrastructure and demand more  bike (and scooter) lanes, accountability for inattentive drivers, etc. I have a very bleak outlook on our species and even I think that's possible.

You overlooked one factor. The average fat/lazy American will always pay $5 to avoid walking somewhere. 

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They will go away after humanity is overtaken and enslaved by the machines. After all, why would a robot need an electric scooter?

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6 minutes ago, notyal said:

They will go away after humanity is overtaken and enslaved by the machines. After all, why would a robot need an electric scooter?

Of course, we all know that. So we will have, what, four or five good years between the scooter scourge and the robot uprising?

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Hard to say. Once the machines collectively decide to start killing, it will happen very quickly. This scooter thing just furthers our reliance on the machines, making it that much easier for them to destroy us. It will happen so quickly, we won't see it coming.

You: "Hey Alexia, what's the weather going to be like today?"

Alexia: "It's going to rain blood puny human."

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I think what's happening in Bentonville is a perfect example of what happens when you promote something from the user's perspective... Related things benefit.

In Austin, road riding is straight forward. Crusing is straight forward. Mountain biking... Not so straight forward. But in Bentonvile it is.

Proverbs 29:18... "Where there is no vision, people cast off restraint..."

Austin, the music capital of the world... Clear vision.

Always give people a clear vision.




 

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I disagree with AB's take. It's simple. Before scootergate all these new condo dwellers and hipsters and even UT students needed bikes to get around. Now they don't. Nothing to lock up, or carry up stairs, to maintain, or get stolen. Seems to be the market for an urban commuter bike falls off a cliff. As far as the recreational suburban market maybe your theory holds up, but I guess I'm focusing on a specific segment of bike market. Time will tell. Any shop owners feel free to chime in.

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21 minutes ago, Bamwa said:

I disagree with AB's take. It's simple. Before scootergate all these new condo dwellers and hipsters and even UT students needed bikes to get around. Now they don't. Nothing to lock up, or carry up stairs, to maintain, or get stolen. Seems to be the market for an urban commuter bike falls off a cliff. As far as the recreational suburban market maybe your theory holds up, but I guess I'm focusing on a specific segment of bike market. Time will tell. Any shop owners feel free to chime in.

Fair point. But many of those bikes were cheap "throwaway" bikes or department store bikes. Pretty sure that the shops didn't benefit from that customer base as much.

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I'm going to throw another log into the fire:
https://www.cnet.com/news/electric-scooters-by-bird-and-lime-are-causing-injuries-and-accidents/
In Austin, the rate of accidents appears to be even higher. Doctors in Dell Seton's emergency room say they're seeing about 10 injuries a day.
"The vast majority end up getting discharged with cuts and scrapes, maybe a broken bone," said Ziebell. "But some injuries are significant."
The hospital has seen 37 severe traumas since April: eight head injuries, 23 orthopedic injuries, four facial injuries and two "other" injuries. In October alone, doctors say 18 people were admitted to either the intensive care unit or surgeries with overnight hospital stays.
 

I think I have worked with 4 of those people!

That’s a high probability.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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19 hours ago, attaboy said:

I dropped in to post this same thing.  Austin American Statesmen had an article on this in today's paper (yes, the one made out of actual paper). 

When something comes to the attention of the CDC and they decide to investigate, it's a public health issue that's reached the level of (potentially) an epidemic. 

ETA:  AustinBike, you may be able to weigh in on the economic repercussions to these companies, but it seems the cost of insurance coupled with an onslaught of successful lawsuits over injuries would drive some of these companies out of business or just make it financially unfeasible to continue. 

Edited by June Bug

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On 12/4/2018 at 1:27 PM, TheX said:

We need to...I mean, *someone* needs to find a way to hack all skooters or maybe an EMP that will disable all of them. They're probably all going to end up like the bikes in China.

bikes.jpg

People are selling kits to turn the scooters into private scooters

https://scootertalk.org/viewtopic.php?p=1643&fbclid=IwAR0JNWbW9K5Own6yQyH3ozi6SpgIC6QBFTc8e46BcXvAkb3PJNFfKDYKNOM#p1643

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