Cafeend Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 and my perennial favorite "It's public land - I can do anything I want". Not to derail and this can be answered elsewhere but what is the correct response to that? It’s been told to me and my response with the eff bomb and douchebaggery was not well received Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridenfool Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 16 minutes ago, Cafeend said: Not to derail and this can be answered elsewhere but what is the correct response to that? It’s been told to me and my response with the eff bomb and douchebaggery was not well received You could start with, "I'd be interested in addressing that, but there's something I have to understand first. You see, ignorance can be dealt with through education, stupidity can't. Which am I dealing with here?" 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First-Blood Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Not to derail and this can be answered elsewhere but what is the correct response to that? It’s been told to me and my response with the eff bomb and douchebaggery was not well received Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkIn my experience it doesnt matter what you say. They are already in a defensive posture and will most likely blow off a cordial fu ad much as a blatant one.Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cxagent Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 35 minutes ago, Cafeend said: Not to derail and this can be answered elsewhere but what is the correct response to that? It’s been told to me and my response with the eff bomb and douchebaggery was not well received Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I try something that shows them just how silly that comment is. Note I didn't say it was the correct response or that it always worked. "Great point! Let's go ride down the runway at Bergstrom - that is public property. After that we can go build a trail on the Capitol grounds that is public property too. Oh wait, there are limits to what the public can do on public property???" You can throw in something close by and well known, it seems to help. Something like "Let's go to ____ and get in without paying the entry fee - that is public property." Note I didn't say it helped. As First Blood posted some people are already defensive and not listening. Others are self righteous assholes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenMTBrider Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, gotdurt said: Anyone happen to check on conditions today? I was out on some job sites and was surprised at how good of condition the ground was in after last night... I’m walking 1/4 Notch now. It’s okay to ride. Some slick spots on the east entrance which are typical and a few areas of standing water, but 95% of the trail is dry. I’ll walk to picnic in a second. I should add that there are some big puddles out here. The trail is mostly g2g but be smart and hike a bike over big puddles. Looks like these areas are going to need to be built up. Update! I’m kind of torn on the condition of Picnic. Good amount of standing water. Sections that don’t have standing water are good. Edited January 23, 2019 by GreenMTBrider 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyyhorn Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 1 hour ago, cxagent said: Let's try the open/closed signs. I expect there will be all kinds of complaints about "the trail should be open" and my perennial favorite "It's public land - I can do anything I want". If the open/closed sign is next to the kiosk, let's put in the kiosk a small description of why the trail should NOT be ridden when it is wet. As long as it doesn't look crappy, could we put that "how ruts are created" diagram in the kiosks? I can't remember who posted it on here or what page it's on, but David has it on the twitter feed in past photos. I would think that pictures might get more views than words in those kiosks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
throet Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 2 hours ago, gotdurt said: Anyone happen to check on conditions today? I was out on some job sites and was surprised at how good of condition the ground was in after last night... Was wondering that myself. Been out of town and returned to learn that we got about 1/3 inch of rain yesterday. Looked nice out there today but unfortunately I've been stuck in front of my computers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tree Magnet Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Cafeend said: Not to derail and this can be answered elsewhere but what is the correct response to that? I think that it helps to take this route: "I want to ride too but all the trails we ride on around here can't handle being ridden when they're wet. I recently found out that these trails were created and maintained by volunteers who are mountain bikers just like us. If we destroy them, the city could decide that they should just stop letting us build them and then we'd be stuck riding on the road which we all know sucks." At this point, you've established that it's not everyone vs. him/her AND you aren't a 'know it all' so they shouldn't want to fight you. If they are still listening, you can then throw down some of our recently obtained soil knowledge or better yet, point them to one of the social media outlets (this one) or groups (ARR, 512) and get them engaged so they educate themselves. I think that stressing the "we" in these conversations is much better than calling the douchebag a 'you'. That is setting up a confrontation from the onset. Edited January 23, 2019 by Tree Magnet 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
throet Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 1 hour ago, GreenMTBrider said: be smart and hike a bike over big puddles Like this? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Tip Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 (edited) Signage won't cure the problem, but it will help. A good salesman will tell you to make a sale easier by telling the buyer why the sale is good for that buyer. So it would help to put on the educational material that "riding mud tears up your bike components" as a way to "sell" to those we are trying to get to "buy" in to the not riding wet trail concept. Edited January 24, 2019 by The Tip 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cxagent Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 38 minutes ago, Tree Magnet said: I think that it helps to take this route: "I want to ride too but all the trails we ride on around here can't handle being ridden when they're wet. I recently found out that these trails were created and maintained by volunteers who are mountain bikers just like us. If we destroy them, the city could decide that they should just stop letting us build them and then we'd be stuck riding on the road which we all know sucks." At this point, you've established that it's not everyone vs. him/her AND you aren't a 'know it all' so they shouldn't want to fight you. If they are still listening, you can then throw down some of our recently obtained soil knowledge or better yet, point them to one of the social media outlets (this one) or groups (ARR, 512) and get them engaged so they educate themselves. I think that stressing the "we" in these conversations is much better than calling the douchebag a 'you'. That is setting up a confrontation from the onset. DAMN! I have some work for you creating similar responses to questions. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotdurt Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 1 hour ago, The Tip said: So it would help to put on the educational material that "riding mud tears up your bike components" as a way to "sell" to those we are trying to get to "buy" in to the not riding wet trail concept. Not to mention that it'll make you look like you had an accident in your pants, and on your car seat after your ride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cafeend Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 Not to mention that it'll make you look like you had an accident in your pants, and on your car seat after your ride.PSA. Sit on a towelSent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMR Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 5 hours ago, Skyyhorn said: As long as it doesn't look crappy, could we put that "how ruts are created" diagram in the kiosks? I can't remember who posted it on here or what page it's on, but David has it on the twitter feed in past photos. I would think that pictures might get more views than words in those kiosks. Along with the “how ruts are created”, there should be a “how to fix ruts, how long it takes, and who actually does it”. I’m sure many people think the city/county employs people to do that. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotdurt Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 11 hours ago, Cafeend said: PSA. Sit on a towel Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk We're trying to find ways to convince them not to ride muddy trails, not give them solutions to reasons... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATXZJ Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 (edited) Unfortunately, a majority of people are just f@cking stupid. Hopefully, you can stop 20-30% of these "mountain bikers" from riding in the wet. Edited January 24, 2019 by ATXZJ 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cafeend Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 Touche'Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RidingAgain Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 1 hour ago, ATXZJ said: Unfortunately, a majority of people are just f@cking stupid. Hopefully, you can stop 20-30% of these "mountain bikers" from riding in the wet. Actually, the majority of people are not "... just f@cking stupid." But most people are certainly selfish... And that's where most problems in a community come out of. Understanding this... The need then is to try and make the matter one of personal concern for those trying to be reached. It's in this that the above billboard messages fail. Truth be told, it's where most advertising/marketing efforts fail. And a sign is akin to a billboard. And there are very specific design principles that should be applied to billboards/signs in order for them to be successful at what they are intened for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RidingAgain Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larlev Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 55 minutes ago, RidingAgain said: Actually, the majority of people are not "... just f@cking stupid." But most people are certainly selfish... And that's where most problems in a community come out of. Understanding this... The need then is to try and make the matter one of personal concern for those trying to be reached. It's in this that the above billboard messages fail. Truth be told, it's where most advertising/marketing efforts fail. And a sign is akin to a billboard. And there are very specific design principles that should be applied to billboards/signs in order for them to be successful at what they are intened for. Nope, most are stupid 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RidingAgain Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 If that were true, then the folks discussing putting up a sign on the trails would be stupid for doing so. But let's not derail this thread discussing what percentage of people are stupid... As what's being discussed here is a good continuation of the broader matter that was being discussed on another thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBaron Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 If anyone makes it out to the trail, please post up conditions. Yes, I subscribe to the twitter feed. But I'm hoping for a current update. Thinking of doing Deception proper after work. Would love to put some wheels down onto PP, but thats not completely necessary if its not GTG. -CJB 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotdurt Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 (edited) Dad gum, people... enough with the sign semantics and yada-yada. Trails are gtg, go ride ya'damn bikes. Edited January 24, 2019 by gotdurt 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 2 hours ago, CBaron said: If anyone makes it out to the trail, please post up conditions. Yes, I subscribe to the twitter feed. But I'm hoping for a current update. Thinking of doing Deception proper after work. Would love to put some wheels down onto PP, but thats not completely necessary if its not GTG. -CJB Deception is in great shape. I did not check peddler's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larlev Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 1 hour ago, gotdurt said: Dad gum, people... enough with the sign semantics and yada-yada. Trails are gtg, go ride ya'damn bikes. Its driving me nuts. Stuck at a dang Costco and all I can think about is riding. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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